The challenges of walking the fine line between calculated risks and costly errors inspired lively discussion among a group of foodservice executives at a roundtable held at the Gaylord Texan Resort & Convention Center this spring.
Moderator:ELLEN KOTEFF editor, Nation’s Restaurant News Participants:REBECCA BLACK vice president of operations and franchise support, Shakey’s USA, Alhambra, Calif. KELLY BUCKLEY chief food innovation officer, Pizza Hut, Dallas MIRIAM McFADDEN vice president of learning and development, Buffalo Wild Wings, Minneapolis CIRABEL OLSON senior director of social responsibility and multicultural initiatives, Dunkin’ Brands Inc., Canton, Mass. SALLI SETTA executive vice president of marketing, Red Lobster, Orlando, Fla. MARK SIMPSON Legendary People department, Texas Roadhouse Inc., Louisville, Ky. TOM SOLOMON vice president Peopleworks, Brinker International’s On The Border, Dallas CARIN STUTZ board member, Women’s Foodservice Forum, Bloomington, Minn. TERA SUNDER chief people officer, Cafe Rio Restaurants, Salt Lake City FARNAZ WALLACE executive vice president and chief marketing officer, Church’s Chicken, Atlanta DIANA WYNNE senior vice president, corporate affairs, Cracker Barrel Old Country Stores, Lebanon, Tenn.
The event, which was presented by Nation’s Restaurant News and the Women’s Foodservice Forum, examined both the pros and cons of risk taking in business, including the ways bold choices can affect foodservice brands, corporate teams and individuals’ own career development.
Moderated by NRN editor Ellen Koteff, the panel featured Rebecca Black of Shakey’s USA, Kelly Buckley of Pizza Hut, Miriam McFadden of Buffalo Wild Wings, Cirabel Olson of Dunkin’ Brands, Salli Setta of Red Lobster, Mark Simpson of Texas Roadhouse Inc., Tom Solomon of On The Border, Carin Stutz of the Women’s Foodservice Forum, Tera Sunder of Cafe Rio Restaurants, Farnaz Wallace of Church’s Chicken and Diana Wynne of Cracker Barrel Old Country Stores.
Excerpts from the conversation are published here.
KOTEFF, NRN: Do you think the current economic climate makes it harder for women to take risks?
McFADDEN, BUFFALO WILD WINGS: I think that it may make it harder to take risks because it’s such a different time. Because the things you would normally fall back on—decision-making or problem solving or gathering information—may not be true [anymore]. But then, on the other side, what better time to make a couple of mistakes and learn fast. I think that to begin that new chapter of learning, [an] organization can use better risk takers right now.
BLACK, SHAKEY’S: There’s a lot of talk about, “Let’s see what happens with 2010, 2011.” The mentality right now is to just hold out and get through, and then be risky.
SETTA, RED LOBSTER: I actually think it’s a really good time to take risks because you also get a little bit of forgiveness if that risk doesn’t work out well. I think people in general who are leaders are going to take more risks.
WALLACE, CHURCH’S CHICKEN: And I think in times of crisis, people tend to revert back to their natural instincts even more so. So if someone is in a stable position, they tend to want to stay more stable, and if they’re not, then they’re willing to make more risks.
KOTEFF, NRN: How do you define risk for yourself?
OLSON, DUNKIN’ BRANDS: I think that it’s something that has repercussions that worry you. What I always say is, “What is the worst thing that can happen, and what is the best thing that can happen?” and I go from there. Usually, the harder ones to take are the ones that have results that are dramatic, like losing a job, like losing money, like making a humongous impact either in your company or in your personal life.
WYNNE, CRACKER BARREL OLD COUNTRY STORES: I think it’s stepping outside the status quo, particularly in corporate cultures. I’m not so sure about in more entrepreneurial [situations], but in corporate cultures, it really is outside the status quo. Many times that’s not easy because those cultures are very deeply embedded, and there’s a high resistance to change. Because, in many cases, that’s how the organization has been successful, right? By doing those same things.
KOTEFF, NRN: As you move from company to company, does it get easier for you to [navigate] those things, and do you become riskier as you move from company to company because you’re getting smarter?
WYNNE, CRACKER BARREL: I think you definitely get smarter. I don’t know if it’s easier. But I think you’re smarter.
McFADDEN, BUFFALO WILD WINGS: I think you do get smarter, but I think that it’s easier for a couple of reasons. One, because you have this history and the experience behind you. But the other is because you’re coming in as an outsider. I was in a company for many, many, many, many, many years, and then stepping outside, it was so clear to me as I looked at and worked with other companies about the culture and what the key attributes of that culture were.
SIMPSON, TEXAS ROADHOUSE: I think you have to think about the impact of your decision and who it’s going to impact, and what it’s going to impact. Who does it affect? If it’s going to affect operations, you have to be very careful because, really, it’s all about executing. It’s about serving your guests. It’s about how we operate in those four walls and being able to take care of the guests the right way to make them want to come back. So I think that’s where you really have to be careful.
SOLOMON, ON THE BORDER: Rarely is risk a singular event decision where you go in and resign or you change careers all at once. I think a lot of times it’s the result of the passion that you have that you’ve expressed maybe in a meeting for this idea or this trend that you want to follow, and you develop it gradually. It’s a process, and in many cases at companies, it comes over time, and it’s not a singular event. So you have to really be passionate about it to keep it alive.
SUNDER, CAFE RIO: I also think that you need to know yourself really well as you go from one job to another. That personal risk piece is making that jump. I went from T.G.I. Friday’s to Starbucks—very different cultures—and found out very quickly that I didn’t fit the culture at Starbucks, and then said, “OK, here’s what I really want to do,” and [I] took time to get to there. So I think that whole thought process of why you’re doing something and where you’re going has to be in your heart.
KOTEFF, NRN: If you had had more information in the interview process, would that have helped? In other words, what would help you make a calculated risk?
SUNDER, CAFE RIO: I thought it was a very good calculated risk for me. First of all, it was a three-month interview process. They bring out their big guns, they give you that whole culture piece, and everything is peaches and cream, and we’re growing. [But] you get there and find out that they—it’s a great culture to be in if you drink the coffee—it’s like if you drink the Kool-Aid, and everybody believes the same thing, then you are going to do just fine. But if you see things differently, if you’re a little bit more forward thinking, it’s hard. And you get there and realize, “Man, I studied this, I learned this, I asked people, I went into their stores, I talked to their operators and, boy, it just sounded so good, but…”
WYNNE, CRACKER BARREL: That’s the point I’m trying to make about it not necessarily being easier because you’re smarter. If it doesn’t fit, it just doesn’t fit, and [it’s about] staying true to yourself.
BLACK, SHAKEY’S: Exactly. And every experience, whether it’s positive or not so positive, adds something to your tool kit.
SIMPSON, TEXAS ROADHOUSE: Somebody was talking about who the decisions are going to benefit, and I think that’s where, as an individual, if you’re going to take a risk—new product, new process, new anything—you have to have some credibility. And the people around you, and really anyone [the risk is] going to affect, has to trust you. You have to have that trust, and they have to know that you’re going to make the decision and that you’re making the best decision possible to the benefit of the company and never yourself.
I think obviously if you had been there for a while and they’ve seen a lot of your decisions work out in the best interest of the organization, then yes.
BUCKLEY, PIZZA HUT: When you’ve got that solid relationship with the trust and the credibility and the support, if you want to try something a little risky, then you know somebody’s got your back. They’re not going to judge you on it. They’re going to see the best of your intentions, and they’re going to be there to support you.
BLACK, SHAKEY’S: Your track record definitely plays a part. But another way to look at it is if you have five successes and two failures, people may remember the two failures versus the five successes. If you’re new in the organization, and you have one success, that’s a little easier.
OLSON, DUNKIN’ BRANDS: They’re even going to say, if you have one failure, that’s bad.
McFADDEN, BUFFALO WILD WINGS: That also depends on what you do with that failure, if you have the presence of mind to communicate about that failure, and say, “Here’s what I learned, thanks for the opportunity.”
BUCKLEY, PIZZA HUT: And show that you’re taking ownership or accountability for that.
McFADDEN, BUFFALO WILD WINGS: Fail fast and go on.
KOTEFF, NRN: Is smart risk taking something that can be learned from a mentor?
WALLACE, CHURCH’S CHICKEN: My question would be instead, “Do you have a diverse team in place, some that are risk takers, some that are not, some that are influencers, some that are analytical?”
SETTA, RED LOBSTER: I tend to tell people that I mentor, “Sometimes when you’re uncomfortable, that’s actually a really good thing.”
BLACK, SHAKEY’S: I think it is part of your DNA. You either are or you aren’t. It’s not something that you really learn how to be. And I think you can teach someone to be less risk averse, and you can teach someone to be more calculated. But it is part of who you are.
OLSON, DUNKIN’ BRANDS: I completely think that you can totally, totally teach it and mentor it. I think the way you mentor it is by telling somebody, “Make sure that you’re going through the steps right.”
SIMPSON, TEXAS ROADHOUSE: I think personally the leadership sets the tone. I think the biggest risk is having people that are probably not risk takers [but] that are more perfectionist driven. What really drives them is they don’t want to make mistakes, and they don’t want to be wrong.
KOTEFF, NRN: How do you decide to take the risk if the benefits might not be felt until somewhere down the road?
WALLACE, CHURCH’S CHICKEN: I talk about that a lot in terms of balancing short-term volume objectives with long-term brand build…you have to do both.
OLSON, DUNKIN’ BRANDS: It’s a very personal thing. You have to decide what is important to you, what do you want. Short term, “[You] did a great job,” or long term, “This is really my legacy to the company.”
BUCKLEY, PIZZA HUT: With long-term projects where there’s risk involved, there are usually milestones along the way so you can keep people engaged. Keep them informed and bring them along as you highlight and celebrate milestones along the way.
KOTEFF, NRN: Let’s talk about some personal risks that we’ve taken—risks that you’ve taken that either paid off or didn’t pay off.
STUTZ, WFF: Sometimes it’s easier to be bolder about bringing ideas for the company than being an advocate for yourself. I was very blessed when I was with Wendy’s to move up the ranks. [But] until I learned to become an advocate for myself, I don’t think that would have ever happened. I remember they used to always bring in people and say, “Carin, I want you to train this gentleman.” “Great, for what position?” “We’ll, he’s going to be your boss.” I finally just said, “When’s it going to be my turn?” And it was that simple, just to be an advocate for yourself, which doesn’t sound like a big risk, but [it can be.] I learned that I eventually had to be an advocate for myself, [and] it did pay off.
BUCKLEY, PIZZA HUT: An important subject, and I think it is very gender specific. Dr. Pat Heim spoke some years ago at WFF. She’s got a whole program on this that talks about the differences in men and women in terms of communication styles, and how they show their passion or commitment about things can often be misunderstood and get in their way of [their] becoming more successful. So once you realize, OK, this is how the game is played and this is where we could be perceived as having a weakness, how do you adjust your style to compensate for that?
SETTA, RED LOBSTER: I think Carin made a very good point. My boss at [one] time wanted to ask me to go and take [another job], but he thought that I might not want it, so he didn’t. He hesitated.… And the whole time I was thinking, “Why don’t they put me in that job? My gosh, I could run that thing.” So it was like this sort of silent thing going on in both of us.
SOLOMON, ON THE BORDER: I think there’s a natural resistance sometimes to toot your own horn, maybe some more than others, and it may be a little bit of gender affected.
KOTEFF, NRN: Let’s try this one: Norman Brinker maintains that if a company is not taking risks, it’s not moving forward. Should risk taking always be rewarded or only when it strengthens the bottom line?
SUNDER, CAFE RIO: I think it should always be rewarded. You know, at Cafe Rio, we always say, “If we’re not growing, we’re dying.” If you’re not moving forward or trying something new, you’re dying. And some of the new things are going to work and some of the new things aren’t going to work. But if you don’t try, you’re never going to know, and if you don’t think differently, you’re never going to grow. And if you can make sure that the risk on those things is fairly low, then why the heck not?
BLACK, SHAKEY’S: Sometimes the negative consequences and knowing what not to do is what actually moves you forward. So “yes” and “yes” to the question.
WALLACE, CHURCH’S CHICKEN: I agree with Rebecca [Black]. I was very intrigued by the question and how it was posed as either/or because I think they both go together. I don’t know if you can drive bottom line without taking risks. And I think it’s the difference between leading from the front end versus leading from the back end. And I think you need to do both, and I think one goes with the other. I have yet to see a company that can grow without taking risks or [grow the] bottom line without taking risks.
BUCKLEY, PIZZA HUT: And I think one of the things [Pizza Hut’s parent company] Yum does very well is it doesn’t just focus on the results. It’s how you got to those results that’s important because there’s a right way of getting there and there’s a wrong way of getting there. Did you bring people with you and did you go through some type of assessment? Were there insights behind what you were doing? How did you actually get there, and how can people learn from that?
SOLOMON, ON THE BORDER: I’m going to take a little risk here and present a contrarian viewpoint. I think it’s two different sentences here, and I totally agree with the first part of that, which is if you’re not taking risks, you’re not moving forward. I think Norman would also believe very much in results orientation. And if you reward all risk no matter what, then there’s no risk because it isn’t risk anymore. I think you’ve got to be able to separate risks that work and risks that don’t and find a way to still foster and encourage risk without false praise because I think false praise takes an organization down.
SETTA, RED LOBSTER: So I think that risk for risk’s sake, risk for personal agenda, is very different than rewarding risk that builds your brand, drives your business, pleases your guests and keeps your employers even more satisfied than they are.
